Get it Straight: Russia was the Aggressor Against Georgia in 2008

In a truly epic act of personal and professional courage, hero journalist Yulia Latynina sides with Georgia against Russia in the 2008 war, telling it like it is for all to see regardless of the consequences, in the mighty pages of the Moscow Times:

There are two versions of how World War II started. The first is that the Polish military attacked a German radio station in Gleiwitz. The second is that Adolf Hitler’s army invaded Poland.

Similarly, there are two versions of how the Russia-Georgia war began in August 2008.

Prior to the outbreak of hostilities, Russia set up military bases in South Ossetia and Abkhazia, a car was bombed in the small Georgian town of Gori, power and gas lines were blown up, and a Russian fighter jet “accidentally dropped” a missile close to Gori.

Moscow also banned imports of Georgian wine and Borzhomi mineral water, prohibited flights between the two countries, and deported Georgian citizens.

And just several months before the war broke out, Russian armed forces repaired a railroad on the Abkhaz border that had the capability of transporting military equipment and ammunition. This suggested that a Russian invasion of Abkhazia was in the works. Russia also conducted maneuvers on the border of South Ossetia and in South Ossetia itself and distributed leaflets to soldiers explaining how to fight Georgians.

As a result, most of Tskhinvali was evacuated in August, and those who remained in the city celebrated the coming war against Georgia. One blogger even wrote, “We’ll fill the morgue in Gori with the bodies of dead Georgians.”

Then, according to the official Russian version of events, Georgian fascists attacked Tskhinvali while its inhabitants were sleeping in their beds.

President Dmitry Medvedev held to the official Kremlin line in an interview with Ekho Moskvy radio, Georgia’s PIK-TV and Russia Today on Thursday, which was intended to coincide with the third anniversary of the war.

Not surprisingly, his statement about the behavior of the Kremlin prior to the outbreak of war differs markedly from statements made by Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili.

For example, Ekho Moskvy editor-in-chief Alexei Venediktov asked Medvedev to comment on a statement — “We will turn this into a Northern Cyprus” — that Saakashvili claims Prime Minister Vladimir Putin made on several occasions.

“This is complete nonsense,” Medvedev snapped back.

But according to Saakashvili, Putin made that remark not only to him, but also to NATO Secretary-General Jaap de Hoop Scheffer, who is probably a better source than Medvedev to determine who is telling the truth.

During the interview, Medvedev was also asked to comment on Saakashvili’s claim that he tried to meet with the Russian president after an international conference in Astana but that Medvedev avoided him.

Medvedev responded that in Astana he had invited Saakashvili to his residence in Sochi. Furthermore, it was actually Saakashvili who ignored Medvedev after Saakashvili met with then-U.S. Secretary of State Condoleeza Rice in Tbilisi. Medvedev implied that Rice had effectively backed Georgian aggression in South Ossetia.

But Rice actually advised Saakashvili not to “succumb to Russian provocations.” That is why Moscow’s claim that Georgia began preparing for the war immediately after Saakashvili met with Rice doesn’t hold water.

It would seem that Medvedev’s main motive in holding Thursday’s interview was to respond to a sharp remark Saakashvili made during an Ekho Moskvy interview on July 8. Saakashvili said Medvedev does not make any decisions himself and that he fits this subservient role quite well.

Above all, Medvedev organized the interview to refute that statement and to insist that he acted with complete independence in protecting South Ossetians from Saakashvili’s bloody aggression. Referring to Putin, Medvedev said, “We communicated with each other only after a full day had passed [after the war had started]. I had already given all the orders.”

We can all easily judge by ourselves whether Medvedev is independent. We don’t need the help of Scheffer or Rice.

About these ads

36 responses to “Get it Straight: Russia was the Aggressor Against Georgia in 2008

  1. in paragraph 3 you failed to mention the funniest episode of the buildup to the war. The Gerogians were flying a drone along the Abkhaz coastline, whe it was shot down. The Georgians protested to the Russians. The Russians swore it wasnt them, then the Georgians released video footage of a mig 29 appearing in frame and firing a missile. The Russians then said it could not have been them as they dont fly jets on sunday!!! There’s a link to the clip on you tube. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNpABtIKERg

  2. Communist U.S.S.R. was built on the big lie. Its successor neo soviet Russia is also built on the big lie. So, I ask has anything changed?

    No, not anything in your wildest dreams.

  3. Of course, russia is an aggressor; it is really pointless to discuss it further; but the most important thing is to see russia going slowly down into an abyss in such a grotesque, pathetic way – three planes dropped off the russian friendly skies in ONE DAY – to experience this is like dying and going to heaven……

  4. let’s start advertising sochi olympics with russian flying coffins WHICH WILL BE USED TO TRANSPORT FOREIGNERS IN AN DOUT OF RUSSIA….

  5. Moscow Believes It Has Successfully Isolated Georgia
    AUGUST 11, 2011
    Pavel Felgenhauer

    On August 8 –the third anniversary of the beginning of the short-lived armed conflict with Georgia– the Kremlin press service announced that President Dmitry Medvedev had sent to parliament for ratification two agreements on establishing military bases in the breakaway territories of Abkhazia and South Ossetia –recognized by Moscow as independent states.

    The treaties allow Russia to keep 3,800 soldiers in both Abkhazia and South Ossetia with heavy weapons for 49 years without paying any lease. The military base agreement may automatically be prolonged for an indefinite period (Interfax, August 8).

    The agreements were signed more than a year ago and have been implemented. The Russian parliament is at present in summer recess until September, when a move to ratify may begin. There was no practical need to send the treaties this week, but Kremlin officials told journalists this was done intentionally – to mark the anniversary of the invasion of Georgia (Novye Izvestiya, August 9).

    Last May during a major press conference Medvedev listed the invasion of Georgia as the main achievement of his presidency: “This was very important for Russia to deem itself strong, no matter how other nations interpreted these events” (EDM, May 19). In a recent interview Medvedev accused top US officials of involvement in provoking the conflict (www.kremlin.ru, August 5). By showing resolve in defending its core national interests with the use of military force and defeating US-sponsored Georgia, Moscow forced Washington to treat Russia as an equal for the first time since the end of the Cold War and to begin the “reset” policy in 2009 (RIA Novosti, August 8).

    This month Russia’s Prime Minister, Vladimir Putin, announced that “it would be very good,” if the people of Belarus and South Ossetia decide to join Russia (Interfax, August 1). Medvedev differed, stating he did not see any legal way that South Ossetia could join the Russian Federation (www.kremlin.ru, August 5). A recently published opinion poll by the Levada Center shows that a majority of Russians (53 percent) today believe Abkhazia and South Ossetia must be independent, while in 2004 a majority believed South Ossetia must join Russia. At the same time the vast majority (almost 70 percent) think negatively about Georgia. The vast majority of Russians, concludes the pollster, do not care much about Abkhazia or South Ossetia per se – any outcome is acceptable, if it punishes Georgia for being too independent of Russia and allegedly too close to the US. Russian leaders and the vast majority of Russians agree that it was a war with the US by proxy (Vedomosti, August 9).

    In his interview Medvedev acknowledged the main objective of the invasion of Georgia, was to “destroy and demolish the Georgian military” (www.kremlin.ru, August 5). This seems to have been a sound strategic plan: if Georgia’s best army and interior ministry troops had been decimated, ambitious opposition figures could have torn postwar-Georgia to tatters, turning it into a failed state as in 1993 after the lost war in Abkhazia against Russian-supported separatists. But the objective was not achieved: the Georgian military was promptly given orders and swiftly withdrew taking most of their more modern weaponry with them, while the chaotic Russian advance hit emptiness. As a result, many of the Russian “heroes” that were directly in charge of the invasion were swiftly and unceremoniously discharged from service: the Commander of the 58th Army, Lieutenant-General Anatoly Khrulev; Commander of the North Caucasus Military District, Colonel-General Sergei Makarov; commander of the Ground Forces and in August 2008 of the staff of the joint forces grouping, Army-General Vladimir Boldyrev (Komsomolskaya Pravda, August 8).

    Georgia is still seen as a formidable foe and a sizable part of the modern weaponry the Russian military is now procuring is posted to face south. The garrisons in Abkhazia and South Ossetia have been supplied with the newest T-90 tanks, long range Smerch and Iskander missiles, and new armor and artillery. Airbases in the North Caucasus have all been given the new Mi-28N night attack helicopters, Su-34 long-range bombers, modernized Su-25SM attack planes (Rossiyskaya Gazeta, August 9). Of course, there is a continuous insurgency in the North Caucasus, but Su-34 bombers, ballistic missiles and new tanks are not used against the rebels – they are deployed primarily for a possible new invasion of the South Caucasus.

    The formation of Russian troops in Abkhazia and South Ossetia is peculiar. Of the 4,000-strong armed forces garrisons in each republic, less than half (some 1,500) are in fact posted in Abkhazia and South Ossetia. The rest are in the North Caucasus, in Vladikavkaz and Mozdok, taking turns in forward posting. The ceasefire line is patrolled by some 1,500 border guards. Economic deprivation of the separatist regions and the lack of artillery and tank training grounds in Abkhazia and South Ossetia are cited as reasons to keep the garrisons divided (Interfax, August 8).

    South Ossetia has no airstrips and the only road north through the Roki tunnel is constantly closed for half the year by snow avalanches and landslides. New tanks, guns and armor are in depots in Tskhinvali, South Ossetia, only hundreds of meters from the ceasefire line, while half of their crews are in Vladikavkaz, separated by 170 kilometers of winding mountain roads. Such a position is utterly indefensible. The Russian command seems not to be considering a Georgian attack at all, though official propaganda constantly stresses Georgian “aggressiveness.” Russian military planners seem to be fully certain that if it again comes to combat, Moscow would exclusively, like in August 2008, decide the timing, allowing ample time to bring in additional manpower and reinforcements to begin a new invasion.

    Moscow has expelled UN and Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe (OSCE) observers from Abkhazia and South Ossetia and has steadfastly resisted all attempts to deploy any neutral observers on its side of the ceasefire line. Medvedev has announced that Russia may forfeit WTO membership if Georgia continues to insist that a neutral EU customs monitoring mission should be placed at the Roki tunnel and on the Russian-Abkhaz border (www.kremlin.ru, August 5). Such a mission could monitor not only the movement of trade, but also Russian troops, undermining the possibility of a surprise mass invasion, like in August 2008.

    Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov has declared Moscow’s arch enemy, Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili “a pathological case.” Lavrov has also insisted that “all Western leaders,” who publicly “support Georgian territorial integrity,” privately tell Moscow, it is no more than “politically expedient” lip service (www.mid.ru, August 8). Russia seems to have successfully isolated Georgia, pressurizing Western nations for the sake of “reset” to effectively ban the supply of new defensive weapons to Georgia. As in August 2008, the West is today passively sitting and waiting, hoping that nothing bad happens.

    http://georgiandaily.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=21739&Itemid=132

    • Meanwhile, north of Georgia, in the land of eternal peace, stability and coexistence:

      Moscow Promises North Caucasus Billions, as Low-Grade Insurgency Continues

      Publication: Eurasia Daily Monitor Volume: 8 Issue: 155
      August 11, 2011 02:16 PM Age: 2 days
      By: Mairbek Vatchagaev

      Having failed to re-conquer the North Caucasus using force or realized the high price to be paid for such a conquest, Moscow is attempting to deprive regional nationalists and religious radicals of their social base of support by providing additional financial infusions.

      In the process of conquering the Caucasus in the nineteenth century, Russia expected the region to become a revenue source for the Russian treasury. However, Russia ended up with a volatile region that always required both extra funding to maintain its loyalty and the presence of a multitude of police and military forces. Therefore, the position of Russian nationalists, who oppose subsidizing the North Caucasus, regarding it as a lost cause, is understandable. On July 25, the Russian ministry for regional development unveiled plans to invest $140 billion in the North Caucasus over 2012-2025 (www.mn.ru, August 1). It appeared, however, that the stated funding was not approved by the Russian finance ministry, which regarded the plan as a threat to Russian economic stability because it required the raising of taxes (www.newsru.com, August 1). Discrepancies between federal ministries –the ministry for economic development, the ministry for finance and the ministry for regional development– show the federal government’s weak understanding of its North Caucasus policies (www.rosbalt.ru, August 1).

      All of this fits into the realities of the North Caucasus reasonably well. For example, according to the Russian government’s development program, Moscow plans to allot the largest chunk of money for Dagestan. This is not surprising, since Dagestan poses the primary threat to the interests of Russia in the region. By diverting more money to Dagestan, Moscow is simply trying to substitute the real problem of the spread of radical Islam with the problem of unemployment and its solution. Moscow is even prepared to provide 100 percent guarantees to foreign financiers, but it is hard to convince businesses to invest in the region, where just during the first six months of 2011 law enforcement agencies have suffered at least 352 casualties, 128 of them in Dagestan alone (www.kavkaz-uzel.ru, July 25).

      The special operation in the city of Dagestanskie Ogni on July 24 was the most notorious recent operation against the militants. Dagestanskie Ogni is situated 118 kilometers from Makhachkala toward Derbent on the Caspian Sea. The authorities announced they had killed three rebel suspects, including 25 year-old Mekhtibek Bashirov, 21 year-old Inna Cherenkova, 28 year-old Islamudin Guseinov, during the operation, and captured 22 year-old Zagra Kadimagomedova, who was wounded. Witnesses at the scene of the operation refuted the official version, stating that, contrary to what the authorities claimed, no explosives had been found. This statement took the government by surprise, as they had announced they had prevented a terrorist attack in the central part of Russia (www.kavkaz-uzel.ru, July 25). Human rights activists discovered that the slain Cherenkova had come from Stavropol and that she cried for help after she was injured and was not wearing any kind of a suicide bomber belt, as law enforcement officials reported after the operation (www.kavkaz-uzel.ru, July 26).

      This event would not have caused such a reaction if the militants, Emir Salikh and his associates, had not communicated a prior warning to the head of Dagestan and the police chiefs using back channels. The militants warned that if government forces were to kill their wives and children, the militants would also renounce their principles and start killing the wives and children of law enforcement officials, politicians and religious figures (www.jamaatshariat.com, June 14). This will lead to new casualties among the civilian population above all. Another feature of this special operation that should be noted is the increasing numbers of Russian converts to Islam. The slain Inna Cherenkova had an Islamic name – Mariam. It has become a fact of life that the Dagestani jamaat has turned into a multiethnic jamaat that also involves Slavs (www.regnum.ru, July 25).

      Without going into details of attacks, shootouts and explosions carried out by the militants in late July, another notorious murder should be noted. Garun Kurbanov, the spokesman for Dagestani president Magomedsalam Magomedov, was the target of an attack and died of his wounds. Kurbanov also held the position of Dagestan’s minister for nationalities, and was the third minister for nationalities killed in the republic in the last eight years. He took the position in Dagestani presidential administration in 2010 after Magomedov became the republic’s leader (www.gazeta.ru, July 28). There was little doubt over who killed Kurbanov and why: he was known in the republic as an atheist rather than a Muslim. As director of the information policy department in the Dagestani presidential administration, Kurbanov was responsible for Magomedsalam Magomedov’s ideological policy, thus Kurbanov’s murder was also a blow to the head of Dagestan. This was also the first time that militants in Dagestan had been able to assassinate someone so close to Magomedov.

      In addition the murder took place the same time an economic forum opened in Makhachkala aimed at showing the republic in a positive light. The same day Kurbanov was killed, July 28, the acting head of the village of Upper Ubeki in Dagestan’s Levashi district, Rabadan Omarov, was shot dead, and three other people were gunned down in Makhachkala. Such attacks will do little to help to improve Dagestan’s image in the eyes of potential investors, and the situation in this republic is unlikely to change drastically in the near future.

  6. Anton (I`m Russian)

    1.There are three version how WW2 began. Actually the most comprehensive is version that WW2 was begun after armed attack against Chekoslovakia by agressive block of German, Poland and Hungary and thanks to silence of Britain, France, USA. Only USSR protested!
    2. You’ll obligatory forget about 08.08.08.It will be very useful for your countries to do it so fast as possible. The sooner you will forget it the better for you, not for Russia. B/O, Sarkozy and Merkel have already done it!

    • I never heard this version, Anton. Whoever told you such a thing?

      Also, there was no “attack”. And thus also no war (even local).

      The only war that Germany engaged in 1938 was in Spain, but it was also never part of WWII at all (and Spain remained neutral during the subsequent global conflict, except volunteers to the Eastern Front).

      There were also some German soldiers (military advisors) engaged in China, helping the Chinese best divisions (trained and equipped by Germany, even wearing German helmets), in spite of the Anti-Comintern Pact, but they were eventually withdrawn after the Japanese threatened to execute them if captured, even before the Pact of Steel was signed.

      As of the Soviet “support” for Benes, he sure believed it, because he was naive (stupid), resulting in the Soviet-made coup against him in 1948. Oh, and he was also genocidal (the Benes Decrees), but hey, let’s keep talking about him as a victim and the Czechs of 1945 were bloodthirsty in general (and so many thousands of defenseless ethnic Germans and Hungarians were murdered – recently there was even a Czech feature film about this, concerning a true story of murder of one German which had citizen-disobedience resisted the Nazis during the occupation only be incredibly brutally killed by a mob their own compatriots, as the Czechs confront the dark page of their history).

      Here’s the history of all this – the events and the aftermath, as seen from Hungarian side: http://www.migrationeducation.org/15.1.html?&rid=14&cHash=837b8c7ccb8bac13c520fabf4be40622

      The film in question (August Habermann was killed by being slowly crushed to death in a mill, and his Jewish wife was deported to Germany upon returning from a Nazi camp):

      • Bobby, it’s quite sad you don’t know that Poland actually blackmailed, invaded and occupied Czechoslovakia.

        In 1938, after signing a pact with Hitler, Britain and France did nothing to prevent Czechoslovakia from being attacked and torn apart by:

        1) Nazi Germany (October 1938, invades “Sudetenland”)
        2) Poland (October 1938, invades “Zaolzie”),
        3) Hungary (November 1938, March 1939, invades Ruthenia).

        Oh, yes, France was officially an allied state to Czechoslovakia in 1938. And Poland was an ally of France.

        Things happen.

        • That was not an “armed attack”, it was a takeover without resistance.

          And most of the people in the disputed territory (very small) were Poles to begin with, and they had been occupied in a 1919 invasion by Czechoslovakia during the Polish-Bolshevik War (in a real armed attack, in which more than 150 people were killed). It’s sad that you either ignored it, or didn’t know about it.

          Trivia: There was also another conflict there after WWII, following occupation of part of the disputed territory by the Polish communist (Moscow-sponored) forces 1945-47. Low level, but a number of people lost their lives. Again. (“And Poland was an ally of” Russia.) This was of course just a sideshow, compared to the massive loss of life during the Czechoslovak persecution of the German and Hungarian minorities (many thousands of people died).

          Well, that’s for the early 20th century. Today, international border there is practically nonexisting (European Union), and there’s no hostility between peoples whatsoever.

  7. I’am russian anton,
    In order you haven’t noticed; chinese siberia is being retaken by chinese, if you think Tartarstan will be under russia for a long time you are mistaken, Karelia is an integral part of Finland, just you know. And my favorite place in Europe Konigsberg, will be part of europe soon. You have to stop feeding your army with the dog food – your humiliation is total and cosmic, in case you haven ‘t noticed, ‘am russian anton……

    • mccusa wrote “I’am russian…” Thank you ! It was funny…You are same “russian” as “russians” from new show “Russian dolls” )))
      Back to the point…your buble about “integrated part of” is applicable for more that 3/4 countries in the World. Particularly, SO & Abkhasia DE-FACTO left Geogia while ago…And as ossetians, as well as abkhazians refused to be “georgians” (sorry if this fact does not suit you). So ? To kill them all ?

      • Typical Russian thinking: “kill them all”. It’s the first that came to your head, okay, but is it also really the only option that you could think about? In 2004, the central control in Adjara was restored without a single fatality, much less “killing all”.

        So, for example, one approach that was already tried was to invest a lot in the areas of Abkhazia and Tskhinvali district (“South Ossetia”) that were under the government control. But as result of foreign invasion, local rebels (“KGB”, “OMON”, various fancy names) and associated armed looter gangs responded by looting and burning everything there, from infrastructure to civilian houses, and currently even an entry there is blocked by the Russian occupiers and their puppet forces.

        • Sorry, but you wrote complete rubbish…Even in the topic are mentioned “Ossetia” and “Abkhazia”. And this presumes local population – ossetians and abkhazians, who in no way want to be “georgians”. It’s up to them ! You can named them “local rebels” ? There is “russian thinking” here if russians did not alow “to kill them all” ?

          • Nobody wanted to “kill them all”. Not even the rebel fighters (of whom a number were taken prisoner and later exchanged for more than 100 abducted Georgian civilian hostages).

            Also notice the Georgian forces were not followed by bands of armed looters (killers, rapists, kidnappers, and most of all – arsonists), unlike the Russian forces in Georgia. That’s a difference between civilization and third-world / medieval style barbarity.

            • Speaking of “third-world / medieval style barbarity” – just north of Georgia is a land ruled by Putinite-Islamist bandits on Russian payroll (wearing Russian uniforms with Russian medal, some even declared “Heroes of Russia” and/or in the Duma). From a new article in The Sunday Times:

              http://www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/sto/news/world_news/Europe/article700475.ece

              She was abducted and taken to a training base where she was kept locked up and under armed guard with 10 other young women. They were kept naked and raped daily by militiamen who also beat them.

              At least one of the girls was shot dead by her rapist after she sought help. Others suffered miscarriages and two became pregnant and gave birth at the base.

              After surviving four months in captivity, Israilova fled with the help of a guard who took pity on her. Deeply traumatised and terrified that her former jailers would find her and kill her, she lived in St Petersburg and briefly abroad.

              Then in April this year, when her brother reassured her that she would be safe and reunited with the daughter she had seen only twice in five years, Israilova, 33, returned home.

              Shortly after going back, the young mother was killed and buried in an unmarked grave, sources in Chechnya told The Sunday Times last week. The crime has not been reported and officially nobody is searching for her.

              “Israilova’s story is deeply shocking,” said a human rights activist who met the young mother last year. “But the horrible truth no one dares talk about is that in Chechnya such crimes against women are becoming more frequent. They’re simply hushed up. The perpetrators are above the law because often they are members of Kadyrov’s security forces.”

              Those deemed to be dressed improperly have been attacked in the street. Honour killings, in which men murder female relatives thought to have brought shame on the family by violating the republic’s moral codes, are on the rise. Such killings have been publicly endorsed by Kadyrov.

              “Women branded by our men as being of loose morals are condemned. Stray dogs are treated more humanely,” another human rights activist said.

            • Some of these bands came from Russia proper, btw.

              And no, by this I don’t mean the Vostok Battalion (the Chechens actually even protected Georgian civilians and POWs from abuse and executions, according to HRW interviews and Vyacheslav Izmailov’s first-hand account).

              I mean the Russian unofficial gangs of criminals (armed looters), composed mostly of residents of North Ossetia-Alania, and they were coming there in and out on the same only mountain road that the Russian regular forces have been using but did nothing to stop them.

              While Russian TV was talking about sending “peacekeepers and humanitarian aid”.

      • Actually the previous administration of South Ossetia led by Chibirov and Sanakoyev was well advanced in negotiations with Georgia regarding reintegration with Georgia in a federal relationship when Putin deposed them in 2005, replacing them with Kokoity and members of the FSB.

        Sanakoyev was then elected to the leadership of the pro Georgian administration of the parts of south Ossetia that were loyal to Georgia prior to the Russian led ethnic cleansing of 2008.

        Considering that the “pro Russian” administration installed by Putin is rated not free I think we can disregard your infantile statement.

        • You’re like a somnambulist…What’s ABNORMAL or UNUSIAL in attempts of to establish “pro-russian” administration there ? Mostly ALL the counties wish to do so. And many countries are able to do and do so on regular/permanent basis for centures ))) US runs same programs around the world. And this is very usual and very understandable policy… Concerning SO & Abkhasia (being next to russian borders) – direct interest of Russia there were/are very-very predictable. And the only idiot can try to make “surprised” face here. At least, it’s more understandable then US doing the same somewhere far away of US.
          So, the only unbeatable point may be here is wishes of ossetians and abkhasians – themselves…

          • Only if you include the Georgian populations opinions in both areas, in Abkhazia as the largest ethnic group, and in “South Ossetia” as the native population.

            And once again, we can disregard your infantile rant aborigenus, you are pathetic.

            • Pathetic ? Maybe…but if to compare with such a somnambulist like you ))) Your point about “largest ethnic group”, because your try to expand georgian ethnic group onto Abkhazia and S.Ossetia (within their today’s territory), but “ocassionally” forgot that the same works vice-versa ! For example, southward outside SO (Khashuri-Gori-Kaspi) there were more that 70 purely ossetian villages/settlements…and this is beside of other ossetians in many other places). And ? All of them – “disappeared”… and nobody cares what did happen with all of them. Regarding Abkhasia, georgians population growns up there during communists ))) Just a sentury ago the figures (for georgians+megrelians) was flwg: 1886-4%; 1897-5.7%… So, it seems you are very hard stalinist/communist . Bravo!

              • aborigenus, you are retarded.

                Ossetians still live in large numbers around Gori and Kaspi, as well as in Tbilisi. In fact there are more Ossetians in Tbilisi than in South Ossetia.

                As for the 1886 census, you forgot the Samurzaq’anoans/Samurzakanians at 44.6% of the population who were Mingrelian Georgians. At the time of the 1886 census groups were defined by language and not ethnicity, though try telling a Mingrelian he is not Georgian and see where it gets you…

                Then there is the fact that all historical monuments in Abkhazia, including 4th century Churches are of Georgian origin, with Georgian inscriptions.

                Of course such ignorance of the historical facts is not surprising from a Russian scumbag such as yourself.
                As for the comment that the Georgian population increased under the communists, yes, but not as fast as the Russian and Armenian populations in Abkhazia did, which grew out of all proportion.

                The Russians rising from 6.7% in 1926 to 21.4% by 1959
                The Georgians rising from 33.6% in 1926 to 39.1% by 1959
                The Apsu/Abkhaz falling from 27.3% in 1926 to 15.1% by 1959

                While the population doubled in this time period from 201,016 in 1926 to 404,738 in 1959. With the above figures it can be clearly seen that the real beneficiaries of Stalinist rule were, as usual, the Russians.

                In 1917 Georgians composed 41.7% of the population, and Apsu/Abkhaz 30.4%, the drop in both populations by 1926 was a result of repressions during the Bolshevik Russian invasion and subsequent mass murder by Russian troops prior to 1926.

                • Also: vast majority of the Abkhaz now live outside Abkhazia / Georgia (up to 1 million). Why? Because they were forcibly expelled by Russian imperialists, after resisting the Russian conquest of the Caucasus (along with many other native peoples), or else they would be killed.

                  Check out this!

                  “The Abkhaz diaspora has been indoctrinated for 150 years to believe that Tsarist Russia was conducting a policy hostile to Abkhazia and they had to flee due to that policy. We have overcome this brainwashing, I daresay-not only we but also Russia with its policy of the last few years.”
                  http://www.government.ru/eng/gov/priorities/docs/4736/

                  Oh, and this “Official Website of the Russian Goverment” looks like if it was made in 1996. Quick, someone tell the Nanopresident!

      • ABORIGENUS, I think that chinese siberia is leaving russia – chinese simply retaking siberia, it own territory that was stolen by russia. . In case of siberia, chinese don’t have to kill anybody this is no man land. Some pitiful russians who still live there are simply starving and are being ingored by chinese. Siberia is a large chunk of your empire aboriganus, in case you haven ‘t noticed…

        • I don’t care about Siberia and Chine…at all. And I have no any idea how will it make you a pleasure, or make your or my life easier. Hmm.., I think it’seven up to russians and chinese to hanlde/to worry about.

        • mccusa
          I live in Siberia, and something I do not see the Chinese. Few Uighurs are traded on the market and about three families of Chinese who organize them. In southern Siberia, Kazakhstan and Mongolia. Maybe you meant the far east. There are Chinese who live on the Russian territory and Russian living in China (there are cheaper to live in the Russian pension). And where did you get that stupid information that Siberia has historically belongs to China, from Polish history books? Great Wall of China saw? So this is the historical borders of China.
          And at the expense of Chinese into Siberia already tired. All who come for the first time in Siberia, then immediately ask, and where you here the Chinese. Showing them a little Chinese market and look at the astonished faces.

  8. Pingback: Davit Kezerashvili – დავით კეზერაშვილი | Seit über 10.000 Jahren Erfahrung in Versklavung

  9. Pingback: Iskander omarov | Pixsimple

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s