In Russia, the old Evils appear in New Guises

Russian author Yelena Chizhova

The New York Times reports:

NOT long ago, Yelena S. Chizhova was engaged in what has become a standard winter pastime for Russia’s middle class: taking the sun at a giant resort hotel in Egypt. She and a girlfriend, who also grew up in St. Petersburg, joined the river of people flowing into the warehouse-size dining hall, its tables heaped with steaming meat and pastries.

And then something passed over them like a shadow. The women felt so uneasy that they had to step away for a moment, and Ms. Chizhova asked her friend what she was thinking about. But she did not need to ask. What the two women had in common was relatives who starved in the 872-day siege of Leningrad, as St. Petersburg was then known, when army engineers set off explosives in the fields and shoveled corpses into the craters.

For a moment, Ms. Chizhova had the strange feeling that she was seeing the piles of food through the eyes of her dying relatives. Born in 1958, she learned the official version of the siege from Soviet textbooks, which cast it as a patriotic triumph. The truly terrible facts sifted down to her when she eavesdropped on her mother and great-grandmother, who lost most of their family in the siege, as they talked quietly over cups of tea.

These snatches of conversation are at the core of her novel, “Time of Women,” which won last year’s Russian Booker Prize, the country’s most prestigious literary award. Ms. Chizhova tells the story of three elderly women raising a small girl in a communal apartment in the early 1960s, where the ordinary business of dishes and laundry is interrupted by memories of purges and famine.

It is an earthbound and frankly emotional novel, especially in a literary scene long dominated by the cerebral trickery of postmodernism. Ms. Chizhova is hoping that Russian artists are ready — finally — to address the good and evil of the Soviet past. Under Brezhnev, people averted their eyes from that past out of fear; under Vladimir V. Putin, she said, it was replaced by apathy. “For the vast majority of people, it simply is not interesting,” said Ms. Chizhova, 52, who smokes and talks with the energy of a coiled spring. “They do not have the feeling that history continues. It seems to them that in the 1990s, we just started over. As if we were all born then.”

But St. Petersburg is a city where blotting out history is difficult. Ms. Chizhova’s mother watched two brothers die of hunger while profiteers were taking fistfuls of gold jewelry in exchange for bread. Her father was forced into a detachment of irregular fighters who were sent against German tanks in groups of five, provided with only one rifle. Neither would have dreamed of explaining this to their daughter. But Ms. Chizhova’s great-grandmother was different; she turned over the memories absently, almost as if she was talking to herself. When Ms. Chizhova, then 5, recited a poem about cannibals in Africa, her great-grandmother explained matter-of-factly how the starving residents of Leningrad resorted to eating bodies.

“I would ask, ‘Where did they get it?’ ” Ms. Chizhova said. “For me it was like a fairy tale. She said some of them bought it in the market, thinking it was just meat. And then she would explain that when she worked in the hospital, they would store the bodies near the hospital gates, and by the time they went home in the evening, some of the soft parts were cut off.

“She would talk about that calmly,” she said. “And I heard it calmly.”

THOUGH the conversations stopped abruptly when Ms. Chizhova turned 6, they had already engraved something on her. When her teachers told her, “All Leningrad, like one person, stood in defense of the city,” her private thought was: It was a crime not to evacuate the children. And 40 years later, the insistent voices of old women began to declaim in Ms. Chizhova’s head, and she sat down to write a novel.

A slender 95 pages, told in a sometimes cryptic stream of conversation, “Time of Women” was not favored to win the Booker Prize, and some critics dripped contempt. Summing up the books of the year for the magazine Literaturnaya Rossiya, Kirill Ankudinov sneered at “literature sitting on grandmother’s trunk and becoming drunk on memories of how well people behaved under Brezhnev,” and Yevgeny Yermolin bemoaned the popularity of “cemetery erotica.”

There is no question that the past is exerting a pull on Russian art. All the novels short-listed for the prize vibrated with the feel of the 20th century, noted Elena Dyakova, a critic at the newspaper Novaya Gazeta.

“AFTER the period of post-modernism, people are searching for some moral bearings, and it’s easiest to find that in the lives of your own grandmothers,” she said. “Theoretically, we consider that there are no decent people in Russia, but empirically, we can show that they used to exist, in any case.”

So it is with Ms. Chizhova’s fictional grandmothers, hardly dissident types, who find themselves at war with the Soviet system as they struggle to keep the girl, Sonia, who is mute, out of a state home for the handicapped. At a moment of despair, knowing too well the bleak life that awaits Sonia in state custody, one of them tries to prepare her.

“You may be locked up and we may not be allowed to see you,” the grandmother whispers fiercely to the girl. “You will have to manage alone. But you should know — wherever you are locked up — I am with you. Any day I am outside the fence. I will keep walking as long as God gives me life. You may not see me, but you should remember — my granny is there.”

Last month, Ms. Chizhova was still adjusting to her victory, raising her eyebrows when a stranger called to invite her to join his literary circle. (“Now that I have won a prize,” she remarked dryly, “it seems I have changed a great deal.”) As the Soviet Union began to fall, she bounced from an economics department — her thesis was on regulated costs in machine-tool building enterprises — to English instruction to the wobbly business world of the 1990s. The last bounce took place on a burning cruise ship off the coast of Turkey, when she spent six hours shut in her cabin, waiting to see if help would come.

“I sat by myself and tried to answer the question of what would be better — to explode or to throw myself into the sea,” said Ms. Chizhova, who is married and has two grown daughters. “I understood that I had done a lot in my life, but none of it was right. And when we were saved, I decided to throw it all away and sit and write.”

That was 1996. Since then she has written for six hours a day without weekends or vacations, producing five novels, three of them finalists for the Booker Prize. It is not surprising, given this, that she speaks about her work with moral urgency. History repeats itself in Russia, she said, the same evils appear in new guises, and failing to study it means repeating terrible mistakes. But her tone softens and blurs when she is asked whether her novel is political.

“If I am honest, I wrote it for those who died,” she said. “I wrote it for them. I was speaking with them. I always had the feeling that they were listening to me.

61 responses to “In Russia, the old Evils appear in New Guises

  1. Harrison Salisbury’s “The 900 Days – The Siege of Leningrad” argues persuasively that it WAS a patriotic triumph for the city and its people. Absent in the featured article is any censure of the German military, who forced such desperate privation – including cannibalism – on the civilian population. That they were unable to take the city in more than two years of siege is a testament to Russian courage; if it should inspire shame in anyone, it should be Germany and the Finns. Leningrad was awarded the Order of Lenin, and the title “Hero City” for the stubborn resistance it offered.

    Ms. Chizova’s instinctive concern for the children does her credit, but the city was completely surrounded by Army Group North and the Finnish Defence Forces except for the “Road of Life”, across frozen Lake Ladoga. Some 1 million residents of Leningrad were evacuated via this route, but it became very dangerous after the first year of siege, as it was regularly bombed from the air. Deciding to try evacuating one’s children under such conditions would be a wrenching decision.

    The deliberate starvation and destruction of over a million civilians formed part of the charges against the Nazis in the Nuremburg Trials for war crimes. President Ryti of Finland was also sentenced to prison for crimes against humanity.

  2. Moscali and their enslaved minnions should not have attacked Finnland, and been better neighbors. Finnland could have been more helpful but decided to fight. Why not?

    Germany was your Maskowski ally when attacking Poland of course. If Maskali had more balls they would have stood up to the Bolsheviks, and non of this would have ever happened. Their middle class was against the takeover. Instead they decided to have a Rashan Riot on Everyone. No Sympathy for Murdering Mascali.

    • That’s “Finland”, and the people are “Finns”, or “Finnish”. Your inability to spell “Russia” properly is beginning to spill over to other countries.

      My country has never atacked anyone (except the United States, when they burned the White House, and you could reasonably blame the British for that because it was a Crown Colony at the time), and has only ever responded militarily when specifically requested to do so.

      You’re apparently not getting the point. Deliberately killing civilians is a war crime. You know, like the Galicia Division, 14th Waffen SS Grenadiers, comprised mostly of ethnic Ukrainians? So I guess the Germans were your ally, too. Not something you like to remember, I’m sure.

      No sympathy for murdering Ukraininans.

      • Mark, you must be very naive to believe that Leningrad was not evacuated because Soviet leaders cared about how many children might die en route. The city itself was bombed and shelled on a daily basis, so it was not much safer. No, they evacuated only those whose skills were needed elsewhere (fortunately, my grandfather was among those) and simply left the rest to fend for themselves because they DID NOT CARE. They actually PROHIBITED evacuation in August and early September 1941 when the siege was not in place yet. And while under siege they gorged themselves on finest foods while the rest survived (or, rather, starved to death by the thousand) on 125 to 500 grams of bread a day.

        Of course, Nazis were gross violators of human rights, and for that they are rightfully execrated today by everybody and his mother. But who was not a violator in those times? One example that comes to mind is the British air raids on Dresden – a city of no military value and therefore with few air defenses – that killed hundreds of thousands in February 1945. I do not know if any Canadian pilots participated in that atrocity, but I would not be surprised if they did. And don’t even start me on the Soviet government that is directly or indirectly responsible for the deaths of tens of millions. Have you ever heard about the Soviet equivalent of Nuremberg trials? Why not?

        Finally, I am not familiar with the Harrison Salisbury book but from what you quote it sounds like a piece of craven Soviet apologetics. Among other things, I can assure you that even in Soviet times the “hero city” award was an object of ridicule rather than pride – among other things, because it was nothing but propaganda fodder and did not improve the lives of the city’s residents a single bit.

        Why are apologists for the oppressive and genocidal Soviet regime still in vogue in the West? And why are you defending them, Mark?

        • What is it with the automatic assumption that if somebody doesn’t agree with your viewpoint, they must be “naive”? Are you somehow more worldly? Better educated? Were you there? Evidently not, or your grandfather couldn’t have been at the same time. Perhaps it’s you who are naive.

          Similarly, you can forget about a career as a student of history or a researcher, if you can make a statement like, “I am not familiar with the Harrison Salisbury book but from what you quote it sounds like a piece of craven Soviet apologetics” without even opening it. You’re just as unfamiliar with it as you were before, because I did not actually quote anything. I mentioned the title, and you must be amazingly insightful if you can spot a piece of craven Soviet apologetics from the title. Hey, what’s the answer to the problem on page 45 of “Advanced Quadratic Equations”? No need to look – you just know.

          Instead, what you appear to be best suited for is one of those talking dolls little girls get for Christmas, where someone pulls your string and you spout, “Craven Soviet apologist!” or “Kremlin stooge!” or “oppressive and genocidal Soviet regime!” from your squawkbox of Russophobe talking points. It won’t matter how many books you read or how much research you do if you’re only looking for one viewpoint – that which supports and validates what you already believe.

          I’m perfectly prepared to accept the Soviet regime was oppressive and genocidal. But the Soviet government is no more, I wasn’t there, and I don’t have any friends or family in the Russian government. My wife’s family is there, and when we visit, I’m treated like one of the family. Officials with whom I’ve had to be acquainted are – at a minimum – polite, and are frequently kind and helpful. This is the Russia I see, and that’s what I know, and I’m not going to embarrass myself by capering around and spouting anti-Soviet dogma at people I love and respect. Nobody who curls their lip and rolls their eyes at Russian culture and sneers that there isn’t any is going to change my mind, because I know differently at first hand. Virtually all my experience with Russia and Russians has been positive, and I’m not going to start hating everyone in Russia just because you do. You have your views, and you’re welcome to them. Pray have the grace to permit me mine, without assuming I must be stupid just because my experience is different from your own.

          Why would you assume I had never heard of the Soviet Nuremberg trials? Of course I have. So what? You already pointed out that there are few in a position to throw stones. Just for fun, Google “war crimes”, and have a wander through the lists by nation. Have a look also at the entries that say “no prosecutions”, and the countries to which they pertain.

          I wasn’t around when the Soviet government was oppressing everyone, but I’m not prepared to hate every living person in Russia now for what happened then, the same as I’m not going to call all Americans racist because they used to refer to their largest minority as “nigger” and “Uncle Tom”, and sometimes whip them to death just for the hell of it. That was then and this is now, and very few are alive who remember it – their experience is not today’s American reality. There’s no use hating the British because they allowed Coventry to be bombed flat, killing thousands of their own people, even though they knew it would happen. They chose not to warn the city, or evacuate the populace, because to do so would have betrayed that they had the Enigma decoder and were reading the German code traffic. A few thousand deaths were assessed by the British government to be worth protecting that secret, and nobody in the British government died in the Coventry raid. The difference is, the victors get to write history.

          Most of the references that mention the evacuation of the million or so citizens who left Leningrad across the lake specify that most were women and children. Many of the remainder stayed behind to defend the city.

          • Mark, I should take back my calling you naive. You are not naive. You willfully choose to defend the worst single regime in human history with irrelevant arguments about the niceness of your wife, her family, and the few Russian officials you met (what does this have to do with the siege of Leningrad??). Therefore you are Soviet accomplice after the fact.

            And you also lie when you say you heard about Soviet Nuremberg trials. FYI, there was no such thing. Unlike Germans (and their Ukrainian and other collaborators) no perpetrators of Soviet crimes ever came even close to being prosecuted.

            You should pick up at least a couple of book’s about Soviet crimes (Alexander Solzhenitsyn’s “Gulag Archipelaho” would be a good start). Your hair will stand on end. But I’m sure you’ll simply brand all those “anti-Soviet dogma” (a cliche of Soviet propaganda, by the way). You prefer to read the books that whitewash Soviet government’s crime against its own people as “patriotic triumph” and lie about the evacuees from Leningrad being mostly women and children.

            • It should be “books”, of course.

            • Kaktuss, you are 100% brilliantly correct! I totally love you!

            • What does the fire-bombing of Dresden have to do with the siege of Leningrad?

              It’s quite true that no Soviet trials were part of the actual trials at Nuremberg, which punished only Axis members. I assumed you were referring to the Krasnodar Trials, and simply calling them by another name as the Nuremberg trials became analogous to all war crimes trials of the period. Gee; death. That sounds awfully final.

              http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Holocaust/WarCrime35.html

              I’ve read, “The Gulag Archipelago”, as well as “Cancer Ward” and “One Day in the Life of Ivan Denisovitch”. In the 1980’s I wrote the Russian government, like thousands of others, to appeal for commutation of Yelena Bonner’s sentence so that she could receive the medical care she needed. I’m not defending the Soviet regime. You are only lessening the quality of your own life with endless hatred, which history shows has never changed anything.

              But if it makes you feel better to call me a Soviet Accomplice, go ahead. Happy to have done my part toward making you feel better.

              • It certainly does not make me happy when somebody says in response to an article mentioning the horrors endured by ordinary people in the siege of Leningrad, “Hey, you forgot to mention it was a patriotic triumph!” Or touts the Order of Lenin as some kind of honor. Would you say the same about the Nazi Iron Cross?

                That is the gist of it actually. You say that hatred is counterproductive, and that is a stance that should be respected (although not necessarily shared). However, you do seem to hate Nazis and their collaborators like Finns and Ukrainians. Why the inconsistency?

                • You know, you’re right. I hate the Nazis because I was taught to hate them, by those who condemned them for the holocaust and because of what I’ve read in historical references. It certainly wasn’t from personal experiences, because I wasn’t there, and the Germans with whom I’ve been acquainted (mostly sailors in the German navy) have been fairly representative of humanity as a whole – some were ignorant halfwits, but most were intelligent, insightful, funny and great company.

                  I still believe Naziism was a blight on human history, but if your broader point was that it’s wrong to condemn Germans because of what their ancestors did, you’re absolutely right. Hypocrisy in ourselves should be just as distasteful as that in others, and thank you for pointing it out.

                  • No, my broader point is that if you hate Nazism you should also hate Soviet Communism, otherwise you are a hypocrite. But you are right, the fault is not yours personally but rather that of just about every Western system of education that usually highlight Nazi crimes but sweep those of the Soviet regime under the carpet. There is most likely a political agenda behind this disproportion, but that is beside the point.

                    As to hating Germans for what their ancestors did – absolutely not! Because they have owned up to their Nazi past, condemned it and apologized for it (most of them, anyway, and certainly all their post-war governments), are ashamed of it, and do their best to prevent it from happening again. They even limit freedom of speech for that purpose by criminalizing Holocaust denial and glorification of Nazis.

                    Not so Russians. Today, both the government and the majority of the people not just whitewash Stalin but glorify him. They even propose to put up posters of him on street corners in Moscow! Can you imagine posters of Hitler in today’s Berlin? A few years ago I watched on a Russian TV channel a concert on one of the minor official dates, like “railroad workers’ day” or something. One of the numbers was a song with a refrain “I was born in the Soviet Union, I grew up in the USSR.” The audience ecstatically joined in! Can you imagine a chock-full concert hall of today’s Germans happily chanting “I was born in the Third Reich, I grew up in Hitler’s Germany”?

                    So yes, there is absolutely no reason to hate today’s Germans. But Russians… I don’t know. That the majority of them are proud of the Soviet past is despicable at the very least.

                    Just about every nation in the world has skeletons in its closet (yes, and Canada too: think about what today you call “First Nations”). But Russia is one of the few (and certainly the only one in the developed world) to hug these skeletons in public on a daily basis.

            • You may be correct when you suggest there were no women and children among the evacuees from Leningrad, or that the one route out was used for the evacuation of scientists and technicians and other valuable workers. I can’t say I know for sure, as I wasn’t there, and have to depend on references. However, this reference

              http://zarodinu.wordpress.com/2008/04/14/the-ladoga-ice-road-the-road-of-life/

              specifies evacuation of 514,069 elderly, sick, and women and children. Wikipedia goes further, and specifically says “approximately 1.3 million…mostly women and children who walked”. But everybody knows Wikipedia was written by Soviet accomplices, so it’s not entirely reliable.

              • 514 thousand and 1.3 million – that’s a huge difference, isn’t it? More than 2.5 times. So one of your sources must be lying. Never trust Internet information. WWW is chock-full of BS because there are no controls. Anybody can post anything.

                Also, skilled workers and engineers were usually evacuated with their families (again, like my grandfather), to keep their morale high. And because families were relatively large in those times, that could in principle result in women and children being the majority of evacuees. But again, the purpose was not to save them.

          • Also Coventry didn’t kill “thousands” too but just 500.

        • Dresden killed tens of thousands, not “hundreds o thousands”. That is about 30,000 residents and an unknown number of refugees, prisoners, etc.

          • You’re right. I used the figure of 250000 that was the standard estimate for many years, but latest research seems to have lowered it by the factor of 10.

        • Here is a comment from another site:

          How is it, that enthusiasts of the most murderous empire in human history, the tsarist/bolshevik/russian empire,

          http://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/NOTE4.HTM

          have the chutzpah to level accusations at peoples who are victims of this empire, and notably at the Ukrainian nation?

          Hitler’s regime was destroyed 65 years ago and many of its criminals brought to justice. But why has there never been a Nuremberg to punish Moscow’s criminals past and present?

          Is it not well past time to put the Muscovite empire on trial for the following:

          1. The subjugation and destruction of many nations.

          2. Mass deportations of people from their homelands and their resultant deaths in the Siberian concentration camps.

          3. The man-made famine of 1932-33 that killed 10 million in Ukraine.

          4. Mass executions in Vinnytsia, Katyn, Lviv, Drohobych, and numerous other towns.

          5. The bloody deaths of countless Polish patriots in the Warsaw uprising.

          6. The murder of over one million of migrants and refugees “repatriated” to the Soviet Union after WW2.

          7. The murder of captured Germans, Japanese, Finns, and others.

          8. The deliberate destruction of the language and culture of other nations.

          9. The brutal liquidation of the Ukrainian Catholic and Ukrainian Orthodox Churches; the execution of thousands of priests, bishops and faithful.

          10 The large-scale slaughter of the Ukrainian population during the 10-year campaign of the Ukrainian Insurgent Army.

          11. The assassination, in the free world, of the Ukrainian leaders Petlura, Konovalets, Bandera, and Rebet, and the bestowing of medals of honour on the assassins by Moscow.

          12. The destruction of patriots of the captive nations by brutal treatment in psychiatric institutions.

          13. The wholesale killings in Afghanistan during the Soviet invasion.

          14.. The building of substandard nuclear reactors such as Chornonbyl in proximity to capital cities of Ukraine and other captive nations.

      • You also seem to have a poor understanding of Canadian history Mark.

        The burning of Washington in 1814 was in retaliation for the US burning of the (named at the time) capital of Upper Canada, York, in the winter of 1812, and the turning out of its population into the snow.

        As for modern Russia not being genocidal, well Mark, I worked with Chechen refugees in New Zealand, and my wife is Georgian with family from Abkhazia and South Ossetia.

        Dozens of my wifes relatives (including women and children) were murdered by Russian military units who were assisting the separatists while “acting” as peace-keepers.

        The Chechens have lost up to 1/2 of their population due to massive war crimes, the Russian military led the ethnic cleansing of Georgians from Abkhazia in 1992-93, and from South Ossetia in 2008, it aided the ethnic cleansing of Azeri’s from Nagorno-Karabakh in the early to mid 90’s, and also of Moldovians from Transdenistr.

        Russia today is the same vile state that it always was, imperialistic, racist, and incredibly corrupt and violent.

        However, there are many good Russians (including relatives of mine), but unfortunately they are very few and far between, and tend to be heavily persecuted for trying to do what is right.

        I find your experience with Russian officials to be somewhat unique, as myself, and every other person I have met or know who deals with Russian officials has found them to be incredibly unhelpful and corrupt.

        • How is that a poor understanding of Canadian history? I didn’t say anything about what motivated it, only that it took place.

          I’m sorry for your wife’s loss. And it doesn’t lessen the brutality of war, but it would not have happened if Sakkhashvili had not attacked.

          My philosophy has always been to mind my own business, and to the extent it is possible, to be on good terms with my fellow man. It’s served me well for many years, and I see no reason to forswear it for a life of festering hatred.

          You seem to have good reason to hate Russia. Go ahead. I haven’t, and I don’t. I’ve also learned that assuming people will always be as they were based on their past virtually assures that they will.

          • Actually Mark, you are showing your incredible ignorance again.

            My wifes family members were murdered in 1992 and 1993.

            Please explain what Saakashvili had to do with Russian aggression in the early 90’s, and with Russia’s traditional imperial strategy of “divide and conquer”?

            Russian creation of and support for ethnic separatism and ethnic cleansing goes back much further than 2008.

            I seriously suggest you get an education Mark.

            In addition, regardless of what people like you think, the ethnic cleansing in South Ossetia and Khodori in 2008 was planned and deliberate, and carried out by Russian military units and separatist militia officered by Russians.

          • So Mark, learn some facts about Russian Imperial history and behavior from the point of view of its victims, and maybe you will see why they are hated and feared by their neighbors.

            • Come on Mark, waiting for your reply……

              the Gagra massacre was where several of my wifes relatives were murdered, along with several hundred other civilians, when after a Russian sponsored ceasefire, a condition of which was the removal of Georgian army units and all heavy equipment from the town, the separatist forces (with Russian military assistance) broke the ceasefire and captured the town, and subsequently massacred its population.

              • Andrew,

                I too am waiting for your reply. Before you spout any more fantasies and dreams about your wife and her relatives getting killed in Gagra massacres, getting beaten by cruel police in Tbilisi demonstrations, etc. – please give references for your claim that the Nazis killed no more Jews than the Soviets that you made yesterday:

                https://larussophobe.wordpress.com/2010/03/09/editorial-secession-in-kaliningrad-and-vladivostok/#comment-67941
                Andrew // March 10, 2010 at 3:55 pm
                Actually, the Russians killed just as many Jews as the Nazi’s. They just did in Gulags by working people to death or shooting them rather than with gas.

                I am waiting for references for your Holocaust denial.

                • Well, the communist regime in Russia killed over 60,000,000 people, most of them between 1917 and 1966, and were well known for anti semitism, for example during the Polish Russian war the Russians were exterminating polish Jewish villages, and during the period of Nazi-Russian alliance were handing over Polish Jews to the Germans.

                  Jews were not targeted as such for being Jewish, just for being in the main “non Russian”, and millions died in Gulags or mass executions, or from man made famines (such as in the Ukraine)

                  http://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/COM.ART.HTM

                  • So, how many Jews were killed in Gulags, Andrew? Please give figures.

                    You made a claim that “the Russians killed just as many Jews as the Nazi’s. They just did in Gulags”. So, give me your number and the references that support your claim.

                  • @Andrew: “Go to a library RTR

                    If I were to make a factual claim, I would go to a library to make sure I am not lying.

                    But it is you who made a false claim here. Now you admitted that your claim cannot be supported by any web page.

                    LR claims that she will ban anybody who makes an unsubstantiated claim.

                    Can you substantiate your claim or not?

                    Or do you want me to go to the library to substantiate your claim? Very funny.

                • By the way retard, holocaust denial is when you deny the holocaust, not when you say there was more than one bunch of genocidal maniacs murdering millions in WW2.

                  German Nazis & Russian Communists, no real difference.

                  • Look. Hitler killed 6 million Jews.

                    In 1926, there were 2.67 million Jews in USSR, in 1941 – 5.4 million, of whom almost 3 million died at the hands of the Nazis, with only about 2.4 million surviving.

                    Given these numbers, I want you to show me how Stalin could have killed 6 million Jews.

                    • Lets see, Nazi Germany was responsible for around 20,000,000 deaths, the USSR for 61,000,000 or so.

                      Who was worse?

                    • Sorry, Andrew, but all sane modern scholars put the number of Nazi victims at much more than 20 million and the number of victims of Stalin to be much less than 60 million. But that is beside the point.

                      Don’t change the subject. We are not talking about the overall numbers. We are talking about your lie that USSR killed at least 6 million Jews.

                      Show me where you got this number.

                    • So your evidence please RTR?

                      Considering that I documented Russian and Nazi totals

                      As I said, learn to read.

                    • BTW, you offer no links to your numbers……

                      DEMOCIDE:
                      NAZI GENOCIDE
                      AND MASS MURDER

                      Chapter 1

                      20,946,000 Victims:
                      Nazi Germany
                      1933 To 1945*

                      http://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/NOTE4.HTM

                      While for Germany

                      DEMOCIDE:
                      NAZI GENOCIDE
                      AND MASS MURDER

                      Chapter 1

                      20,946,000 Victims:
                      Nazi Germany
                      1933 To 1945*

                      http://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/NAZIS.CHAP1.HTM

                    • @Look. Hitler killed 6 million Jews.

                      “Look”, actually no one really knows how many. Might be 7 million. Might be 5 million. It’s just an estimate of someone and then an another of someone else.

                      It’s not an any kind of dogma you might think it is. People used to think 4 million people died at Aschwitz (a Soviet & Polish Communist “estimate”), now it’s only 1 million according to the camp museum. How many people died in Poland in WWII? 6 million? No, it was completely invented number (by one communist aparatchik, without any study at all). Maybe 4.5 million. Maybe 11 million. Nobody really knows. Also everything depends on how you counts.

                      So, how many people died because of Stalin? I think even Stalin couldn’t tell you if you asked him. How many Jews? Well, I can tell only you none thing for sure: Less than what what was in his plans for them.

                      Hey, how many Russians died in WWII? How many SOVIETS died in WWII? How many people worldwide died in WWII? No one knows and there’s just no definitive figure – even the official ones in Russia are changing all the time (widely different under Stalin, Khrushchev, now). And the various global losses estimates are varying in a range of tens of millions.

                      That’s just my 3 cents. For you too, Andrew.

                    • Good points as always Robert.

                • By the way, Russian crimes in Abkhazia (and now South Ossetia), not to mention Chechnya and so on, are very very well documented.

                  As for my wifes relatives, they died alright, and she was in the April 9th protests.

                  So RTR, go and play with yourself, its the only action you will ever get.

      • @You know, like the Galicia Division, 14th Waffen SS Grenadiers, comprised mostly of ethnic Ukrainians? So I guess the Germans were your ally, too.

        Cool. I guess the same applies to RONA, 29th Waffen Grenadier Division (1st Russian), right?

        • I guess so. Was there a Canadian Waffen SS Division? Where are you going with that? I’m not a Russian. Georg is always shrieking about the Rassian/Rooshan/Raskana as if he could speak from a position of moral superiority or something. I get it. He hates Russians. Just as long as he doesn’t think Ukrainians are descended from the angels. There are good people and evil people among every race and grouping, and as soon as you start thinking your side is incapable of evil, you’re incapable of objectivity.

  3. Maskali have used the Jewish Card against Ukraine and there were even Jews in UPA fighting with Ukrainians against your murdering commie Rashan Butchers.

    Again your Moskowski Minnions have used other peoples whenever possible in your conspiracies and wars. Just recently.

    FROM THE “ORDER ISSUED BY THE MAIN COMMAND OF THE ARMIES OF THE UKRAINIAN NATIONAL REPUBLIC”—26 AUGUST 1919

    It is time to realize that the world Jewish population—their children, their women—was enslaved and deprived of its national freedom, just like we were.

    It should not go anywhere away from us; it has been living with us since time immemorial, sharing our fate and misfortune with us…

    I decisively order that all those who will be inciting you to carry out pogroms be expelled from our army and tried as traitors of the Motherland. Let the courts try them for their actions, without sparing the criminals the severest punishments according to the law. The government of the UNR, understanding all the harm that pogroms inflict on the state, has issued a proclamation to the entire population of the land, with the appeal to oppose all measures by enemies that instigate pogroms against the Jewish population…

    Chief otaman Petliura

    FROM THE PROCLAMATION “AGAINST POGROMS”—12 OCTOBER 1919

    Our National Army must bring equality, fraternity, and liberation to Ukrainian and Jewish citizens because the latter actively support the Government of the UNR. All their parties, like the Bund, the United [Jewish Socialists], Poalei-Zion, and the Folks-Partei have adopted the platform of Ukraine’s independence and are taking part in building the republic.

    I myself know of cases where the members of the Jewish population assisted our army and supported the legal republican government.

    I have great respect for those sacrifices that the Jewish population endured on the altar of our motherland in this struggle […]

    The death penalty must fall on the heads of pogromists and provocateurs.

    Chief otaman Petliura

    The twentieth anniversary of the founding congress of the People’s Movement (Rukh) of Ukraine will be marked soon. Does anyone remember how, twenty years ago, the official Soviet press frightened readers with statements, like “The members of Rukh are anti-Semites”? I remember because my congratulatory telegram was read out at Rukh’s founding congress, and it ended with the Hebrew word, “Shalom!”

    In early 1990 the government launched a scare campaign targeting the Jews of Kyiv. Female caretakers went around warning them: “Rukh members armed with machine guns are coming from Lviv. Don’t leave your houses. There will be pogroms.” The Ukrainian philosopher Myroslav Popovych and I made it onto TV, and the provocateurs were silenced.

    On 1 December 1991 an explosive device was found in a Kyiv synagogue—the day that the referendum on Ukraine’s independence was slated to take place. The message was clear: ‘See? They haven’t even managed to become independent and synagogues are being blown up.’ This explosive device was placed beneath Ukrainian Independence.

    According to the fabrications of Moscow’s political technologists, manipulated by Russia’s special services, in 2003 and 2004 the opponents of Ukrainian presidential candidate Victor Yushchenko began disseminating rumors and publications and shooting a film about “the anti-Semitism of Yushchenko and his milieu.” In December 2003 Victor Yushchenko greeted the Jews of Ukraine on Hanukkah. No such message was prepared in the administration of President Leonid Kuchma. In his message to the Jews of Ukraine during Hanukkah, and later during Passover, Victor Yushchenko emphasized: “The history of the Jews has much to teach all of us.” Citing a line from a poem by Ukraine’s greatest female poet Lesia Ukrainka, he said: “And you, my Ukraine, once struggled like Israel.” At that time, I informed the Jewish community of Ukraine that during the Second World War Victor Yushchenko’s mother, who was living in the village of Khoruzhivka, risked her life by hiding three Jewish girls from the city of Romny—for one and a half years.

    At that point the campaign to smear Victor Yushchenko as an anti-Semite fizzled out. The film production, which had already cost a considerable amount of money, was halted. We won on Independence Square.

    But the Russian special services continue to play the “Jewish card” in their special operations against Ukraine.

    http://www.khpg.org.ua/index.php?id=1245844840

    • “During the night of 15 April 2008, the memorial to Rabbi Aaron at the Jewish cemetery in Zhitomir was set on fire. The perpetrators also painted swastikas, “Satan is come” and other antisemitic and satanic graffiti. The same grave was desecrated in November 2007. Local Jewish leaders called the police to put an end to the repeating antisemitic incidents and the European Jewish Congress condemned the incident. A week after the incident, the police claimed that three teenagers were playing soccer near the cemetery and lit a fire there in order to warm up. The fire got out of control and burned down the memorial. The police did not mention the graffiti.

      On 24 April 2008 it was discovered that 11 gravestones were broken at the Jewish cemetery in Bolgrad, in the Odessa region.

      In June 2008 tourists from France discovered a Star of David on gallows on a memorial plaque at the Kleparov train station in Lvov. The plaque marks the place from where the Nazis shipped 500,000 Jews to the Belzec death camps in Poland during 1941-1943.

      On 14 July 2008, for the 5th time in a year, a Holocaust memorial and the “Mourning Mother” memorial, located on a mass grave in Poltava, were desecrated with paint, Ukrainian national symbols and racist and antisemitic graffiti, including a Star of David on gallows and “Death to the Jews”. The Holocaust memorial is dedicated to more than 3000 local Jews who were murdered by the Nazis on 23 November 1941. The other memorial is in honor of about 5000 Red Army prisoners of war and partisans murdered during World War II in the region.

      On 7 August 2008 swastikas and “Long live the Nazis” were discovered on a memorial to Holocaust victims of the Janovska concentration camp near Lvov.”

      http://www.ejpress.org/article/30052

      Quack, quack quack. If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it must be Georg.

      • A selection (and by no means all) of anti Semitic attacks in Russia in 2009

        Russian racism is fairly well known Mark….

        http://www.adl.org/Anti_semitism/anti-semitism_global_incidents_2009.asp#Russia

        December 14, 2009 – Smolensk – A public menorah was damaged by vandals.

        December 5, 2009 – Moscow – Two identifiably Jewish Israelis were attacked outside a Moscow yeshiva. Both men were hospitalized.

        December 1, 2009 – Moscow – A 25 year-old identifiably Jewish man was assaulted in the subway. The attacker, an alleged neo-Nazi, shouted “Heil!” and hit the victim, who suffered minor injuries. The police detained an individual, but charged him only with “minor hooliganism.”

        September 12, 2009 – Khabarovsk – Two Molotov cocktails were thrown at a synagogue. Four skinheads, aged 15 to 23, were arrested and charged with arson. The home of a police officer who investigates racist crimes was also firebombed the same night.

        July 16, 2009 – Komi Republic – A rock was thrown through the window of the Syktyvkar Jewish community center. It was the second time this year that unknown vandals had attacked the building.

        July 12, 2009 – Ryazan – Unknown vandals painted swastikas on the doors of a Jewish community center.

        June 19, 2009 – Abakan – A swastika was spray-painted on the entrance doors of a Jewish community center.

        May 14, 2009- Nizhny Novgorod – Fourteen Jewish graves were desecrated in Nizhny Novgorod in early May. The Marina Roscha cemetery had been the target of vandals on several previous occasions.

        May 12, 2009 – Pskov – Swastikas were painted on the door of the Jewish social service center, “Chesed Itzhak.”

        May 7, 2009 – Norilsk – A monument to Jewish victims of Stalin’s repression was spray-painted with crossed-out Stars of David and anti-Semitic epithets.

        March 30, 2009 – Sebezh – A Jewish cemetery was desecrated. The perpetrators burned wreaths and damaged 18 tombstones.

        March 11, 2009 – Petrozavodsk – A Holocaust memorial in a Jewish cemetery was vandalized.

        February 17, 2009 – Yaroslavl – Rocks were thrown through the windows of a synagogue. No one was injured.

      • @Mark, your the AgitProp Maskal, to divide us for easy pickings, so you deserve Putin’s Protection. The heroes are still are out there as an example to the overwhelming majority still living under the Kremlin’s Threats. Maskva is loosing the war for our minds, you should just give up. You lost!

        The Jewish card in Russian special operations against Ukraine
        24.06.09 | Moses Fishbein

        During his speech at an expanded session of Russia’s Federal Security Service (FSB), which was held on 29 January 2009, the president of the Russian Federation, Dmitry Medvedev, revealed an FSB special operation in a few brief sentences: “An unstable sociopolitical situation persisted in a number of neighboring states, there were continued attempts to enlarge NATO, including by means of granting Georgia and Ukraine accelerated membership in the alliance. Naturally, all this required precise and well coordinated work on the part of all special security, defense, and law enforcement structures, and quite a high level of coordination of their activities. I must say straight away that on the whole the Federal Security Service successfully carried out all its tasks.”

        In other words, the president of the Russian Federation openly declared that the wrecking of Ukraine’s planned integration into NATO was the work of the Russian special services, the result of special operations that they had put into motion. Afterwards, the Russian president thanked the FSB. This is direct acknowledgement of the fact that the Russian special services are conducting special ops against Ukraine, which are aimed at undermining its sovereignty and independence. This is a brutal violation not just of international law. This is also a brutal violation of Russian laws: the legislative base of the Russian Federation, which controls the FSB’s activities, does not permit this special service to conduct such specials operations. There is not a single word about any special operations in the “Federal Law on the Federal Security Service” that was passed by the State Duma of the Russian Federation on 22 February 1995 (with all subsequent revisions). Take note: this document, which was signed by the president himself, does not contain a single word about any special operations against Ukraine, in connection with which President Medvedev recently congratulated the FSB.

        However, there is a concrete stipulation among the direct tasks of the FSB concerning the halting and prevention of leaks of state and military secrets. The FSB’s special operation, aimed at preventing Ukraine’s accession to NATO, is one of the Kremlin’s biggest secrets—and Mr. Dmitry Medvedev was instrumental in leaking this very secret.

        The Russian special services continue to carry out special operations aimed at undermining Ukraine’s sovereignty and independence. The members of the FSB and Russia’s Foreign Intelligence Service were rewarded for their success in isolating Ukraine. In recent months, the number of personnel in the FSB structures that deal with Ukraine has increased by 1.5 times, and this increase is reminiscent of the 1950s, when the underground Ukrainian Insurgent Army (UPA) was active in Ukraine.

        One aspect of Russia’s special operations against Ukraine is the so-called “Jewish card.” But first, a little history lesson is in order here. When did the imperialist gamblers begin playing the “Jewish card” on Ukrainian territory?

        This was done in the Russian Empire.

        For many years Symon Petliura was proclaimed a pogromist in the USSR. It was of no importance that one of the founders and key ideologists of Zionism, the distinguished journalist, civic and political leader Vladimir (Ze’ev) Zhabotinsky had a deep and abiding respect for Petliura, because Zhabotinsky’s own name was taboo in the Soviet Union.

        Shortly after Petliura was assassinated in Paris, on the fortieth day after his death—4 July 1926—Zhabotinsky wrote an article that was published in the New York newspaper, The Jewish Morning Journal. It states in part:

        Neither Petliura nor Vynnychenko, nor the rest of the distinguished members of this Ukrainian government, were ever “pogromists,” as they are called…I know this type of Ukrainian intellectual-nationalist with socialist views very well. I grew up with them; together with them I waged a struggle against anti-Semites and Russifiers—Jewish and Ukrainian. No one will ever convince me or the rest of the thinking Zionists of southern Russia that these types of people may be considered anti-Semites.

        On 28 May 2009 Boris Shpigel, a Russian senator and the head of the World Congress of Russian Jewry (WCRJ), which was founded on the initiative of the Russian special services, had a meeting in Jerusalem with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu of Israel, during which he raised the topic of anti-Semitism. During their conversation he declared that “old national heroes are being restored” in Ukraine, those who committed crimes against the Jews, and “history is being rewritten by whitewashing them.” Shpigel cited the example of Symon Petliura. As the Israeli media later reported, “Mr. Netanyahu expressed concern.” It should be noted that Israel’s Likud Party, which is headed by Benjamin Netanyahu, represents the ideological current of Vladimir (Ze’ev) Zhabotinsky whose portrait hangs in this party’s headquarters.

        Here I quote Symon Petliura himself.

        FROM THE “ORDER ISSUED BY THE MAIN COMMAND OF THE ARMIES OF THE UKRAINIAN NATIONAL REPUBLIC”—26 AUGUST 1919

        It is time to realize that the world Jewish population—their children, their women—was enslaved and deprived of its national freedom, just like we were.

        It should not go anywhere away from us; it has been living with us since time immemorial, sharing our fate and misfortune with us…

        I decisively order that all those who will be inciting you to carry out pogroms be expelled from our army and tried as traitors of the Motherland. Let the courts try them for their actions, without sparing the criminals the severest punishments according to the law. The government of the UNR, understanding all the harm that pogroms inflict on the state, has issued a proclamation to the entire population of the land, with the appeal to oppose all measures by enemies that instigate pogroms against the Jewish population…

        Chief otaman Petliura

        FROM THE PROCLAMATION “AGAINST POGROMS”—12 OCTOBER 1919

        Our National Army must bring equality, fraternity, and liberation to Ukrainian and Jewish citizens because the latter actively support the Government of the UNR. All their parties, like the Bund, the United [Jewish Socialists], Poalei-Zion, and the Folks-Partei have adopted the platform of Ukraine’s independence and are taking part in building the republic.

        I myself know of cases where the members of the Jewish population assisted our army and supported the legal republican government.

        I have great respect for those sacrifices that the Jewish population endured on the altar of our motherland in this struggle […]

        The death penalty must fall on the heads of pogromists and provocateurs.

        Chief otaman Petliura

        The twentieth anniversary of the founding congress of the People’s Movement (Rukh) of Ukraine will be marked soon. Does anyone remember how, twenty years ago, the official Soviet press frightened readers with statements, like “The members of Rukh are anti-Semites”? I remember because my congratulatory telegram was read out at Rukh’s founding congress, and it ended with the Hebrew word, “Shalom!”

        In early 1990 the government launched a scare campaign targeting the Jews of Kyiv. Female caretakers went around warning them: “Rukh members armed with machine guns are coming from Lviv. Don’t leave your houses. There will be pogroms.” The Ukrainian philosopher Myroslav Popovych and I made it onto TV, and the provocateurs were silenced.

        On 1 December 1991 an explosive device was found in a Kyiv synagogue—the day that the referendum on Ukraine’s independence was slated to take place. The message was clear: ‘See? They haven’t even managed to become independent and synagogues are being blown up.’ This explosive device was placed beneath Ukrainian Independence.

        According to the fabrications of Moscow’s political technologists, manipulated by Russia’s special services, in 2003 and 2004 the opponents of Ukrainian presidential candidate Victor Yushchenko began disseminating rumors and publications and shooting a film about “the anti-Semitism of Yushchenko and his milieu.” In December 2003 Victor Yushchenko greeted the Jews of Ukraine on Hanukkah. No such message was prepared in the administration of President Leonid Kuchma. In his message to the Jews of Ukraine during Hanukkah, and later during Passover, Victor Yushchenko emphasized: “The history of the Jews has much to teach all of us.” Citing a line from a poem by Ukraine’s greatest female poet Lesia Ukrainka, he said: “And you, my Ukraine, once struggled like Israel.” At that time, I informed the Jewish community of Ukraine that during the Second World War Victor Yushchenko’s mother, who was living in the village of Khoruzhivka, risked her life by hiding three Jewish girls from the city of Romny—for one and a half years.

        At that point the campaign to smear Victor Yushchenko as an anti-Semite fizzled out. The film production, which had already cost a considerable amount of money, was halted. We won on Independence Square.

        But the Russian special services continue to play the “Jewish card” in their special operations against Ukraine.

        In mid-April 2008 the Russian Internet site IA_REGNUM posted information claiming that an Israeli historian named Yury Vilner had published a book entitled Andrii Yushchenko: The Person and the “Legend.” The following sentence instantly began circulating from website to website: “The research proves that during the Second World War the father of the president of Ukraine may have been a camp policeman and Nazi informer.” Few people paid any attention to the stylistic shortcoming of the phrase “proves that…he may have been.” Later, the text of this “book” ended up on the Internet. I started reading it. The book contained the dedication, “To the humanist Aron Shneer.”

        Who is Aron Shneer? I finally remembered that the Israeli journalist Mikhail Kheifetz—the same former Soviet political prisoner who wrote brilliant reminiscences of the Ukrainian poet and political prisoner Vasyl Stus—cited Aron Shneer in one of his articles. Dr. Aron Shneer is a Yad Vashem researcher and scholar. I telephoned him. It turns out that he had read the text of the “investigation” on the Internet, but had no idea who Yury Vilner was. The Russian website http://www.regnum.ru claimed: “This book, published in Israel, has appeared in Moscow,” but no one either in Israel or in Russia—or anywhere else for that matter—neither scholars nor journalists knew about the existence of this “Israeli.”

        I started looking at the book’s ISBN, the unique numeric commercial identifier, which is 969-228-292-5. The first three numbers indicate the country where the book was published. It turns out that “969” is Pakistan. One could, therefore, assume that the book was assigned its registration number in this country. But a search of this publication in the ISBN databank showed that such a book did not exist. This means that the ISBN was fabricated, and hence the “book” itself and its “author” are fabrications created and launched into circulation by means of anti-Ukrainian special operations whose goal is to create difficulties in Ukrainian-Israeli relations, cause mischief between the Ukrainians and Jews, and alarm the international community by exposing the “dark pages of the fascist past” of the Ukrainian president’s father. Within a few days after this book appeared on the http://www.regnum.ru website, on 18 April 2008 this fabrication was exposed simultaneously on the pages of the Kyiv-based newspaper Ukraina moloda and an Israeli website, which information quickly spread throughout the Internet. Another anti-Ukrainian special operation was nipped in the bud.

        In its imperialistic frenzy, which stems from its acute inferiority complex, the Russian leadership, with the help of its special services, is trying to brainwash both the international community and Russian society with its Ukrainophobia, and through the mass media and agents of influence which they control—a certain segment of Ukraine’s population.

        In playing the “Jewish card” in their special operations against Ukraine, the Russian special services are exploiting their “Putin-Juden,” particularly Moscow-based rabbis.

        The following statements are taken from the website of the “Eurasian Youth Movement”:

        Rabbis and Eurasians joining forces in the struggle against Nazism

        21 August 2007

        On 20 August an official meeting took place at the synagogue located on Spasoglenishchevskii Pereulok [Lane] in Moscow between the leader of the Eurasian Youth Movement, Pavel Zarifullin, and the chief rabbi of Russia, Adolf Shaevich. During the talks the leader of the EYM and the chief rabbi of Russia reached the conclusion that they have one common enemy—contemporary Ukrainian neo-Nazism, the quasi-official ideology of the “Orange” government of Victor Yushchenko of Ukraine.

        From the Novosti portal “Eurasia”:

        Eurasians and Jews are for traditionalism and against Ukrainian state fascism

        11 November 2008

        On 11 November a meeting took place in the Moscow synagogue located in Mariina Roshcha between the chief rabbi of Russia, Berl Lazar, and the head of the main administration of the International “Eurasian Movement,” Pavel Zarifullin.

        During the talks Rabbi Lazar expressed his profound concern in connection with the revival of Nazism in Ukraine and the Baltic republics. He discussed the awarding of the title of “Hero of Ukraine” to the SS executioner Shukhevych. Russia’s chief rabbi emphasized that Ukraine’s accession to the EU and other international organizations should be prevented, and he appealed to the guests to use their connections and reputations in the struggle against the restoration of Nazism.

        On 17 September 2008 the well-known Russian journalist Aleksandr Prokhanov and editor of the newspaper Zavtra (Tomorrow)—of whom it is said, “What Putin has on his mind, Prokhanov has on his tongue”—the same Prokhanov who openly calls himself an imperialist—was interviewed by the Ekho Moskvy radio station: “Stalin is becoming the face of Russia…Russia is a potential superpower. Otherwise, it will fall apart.” He went on to declare: “We have achieved this very crisis in Ukraine.” In reply to the female journalist’s question, “What must be done right now?” he said: “Yushchenko must be neutralized.”

        High-ranking Russian politicians, particularly the mayor of Moscow, are publicly issuing claims to Ukrainian territory. Cultivated and welcomed by the Russian leadership, provocateurs are plundering national Ukrainian hallowed sites on Mt. Hoverla, and shredding and trampling the Ukrainian flag near the Ukrainian Embassy in Israel. During a press conference held on 28 October 2008 Vitaly Churkin, the Permanent Representative of the Russian Federation at the UN, made the following comment about the Holodomor, the Great Famine of 1932-33 in Ukraine: “…the Ukrainian government is using this question in order to create mischief between our two fraternal nations and sow discord between our peoples…No matter what repressions or actions were carried out by the Stalinist regime, it cannot be called the primary cause of the Famine…And it is wrong to say that the Stalinist regime was against the Ukrainian people.”

        I don’t know if Churkin the diplomat has ever read Forever Flowing, a book about the Holodomor that was written by the famous Russian writer Vasily Grossman. I don’t know if Mr. Churkin reads anything besides “instructions from the Center.” But his statement is nothing but shameless profanity. The other comments that he made during that press conference at the UN headquarters are also nothing but shameless profanity and arrogant lies. I quote: “…The second question…which, in my opinion, has a definite, logical connection with the first, is the question of the heroization of Nazism…In his edict bestowing an award on one of the odious members of the Ukrainian Nazi movement, the President of Ukraine called Mr. Shukhevych, who was a Nazi, a hero…Do you remember that thousands of Jews were killed on the territory of Kyiv? The majority of the people who were killing Jews in Babyn Yar were Ukrainian Nazis.”

        “Ukrainian Nazis”? In other words, some Ukrainians who were supposedly members of Hitler’s National Socialist German Workers Party, the NSDAP, were shooting Jews in Babyn Yar, and not Germans from the Einsatzkommando? “Shukhevych, who was a Nazi”? In other words, Shukhevych, who was supposedly a member of the Nazi Party yet was based in Galicia, was in some fashion involved in the shootings in Babyn Yar? Anyone who says this is either an ignoramus or a disinformation specialist. I hope that Mr. Churkin is at least not an ignoramus.

        I would like to remind Mr. Churkin that from 1939 to 1941 the USSR, whose successor today is the Russian Federation, was an ally of Nazi Germany. How can one forget all those movie reels showing the joint Soviet-German military parades? I would also like to remind him of the way the special disinformation operation targeting Roman Shukhevych, the Commander in Chief of the Ukrainian Insurgent Army (UPA), is being conducted today. Initially, a story was planted in the mass media, claiming that Shukhevych was an “SS captain.” The rebuttal to the disinformation specialists was that there was never any such rank. Then the disinformation specialists transformed Shukhevych into some sort of Obersturmfuehrer. It was explained to them that in order for an individual to become a member of the SS, he had to expend a lot of effort on proving his Aryan origins, which Shukhevych naturally did not have.

        Then the disinformation specialists planted another story in the mass media, this one claiming that Shukhevych had received a military decoration from Hitler himself. They were reminded that the only person had ever received a military decoration from Hitler was Himmler. According to documents stored in Germany’s Military Archive in Freiburg, the Commander in Chief of the UPA was never awarded any German decoration.

        But the disinformation specialists desperately need to discredit not only General Shukhevych and the UPA but the entire Ukrainian national liberation movement, as well as the president of Ukraine, Viktor Yushchenko.

        So they have resorted to an old Soviet secret police provocation by playing the “Jewish card”: they accuse some Ukrainians of destroying Jews, and others of turning into heroes those whom they were allegedly destroying. This is a well-known device: turn the Jews away from the Ukrainian renaissance, turn the Jews and the entire civilized world away from those who seek to restore a genuine Ukrainian Ukraine—Ukrainian in spirit, language, and remembrance of its geniuses and heroes—a Ukrainian Ukraine for all those who live in that country today, regardless of ethnic origins.

        In 1942-43 Natalia Shukhevych, the wife of UPA Commander in Chief Roman Shukhevych, hid a young Jewish girl named Ira Reichenberg in her home. General Shukhevych prepared a fake passport for the girl in the name of Iryna Ryzhko. When the Gestapo arrested Mrs. Shukhevych, the little girl was brought to an orphanage based at a convent located in the village of Kulykiv in the Lviv region. There the little girl survived the German occupation and the war. In 2007 Iryna Ryzhko died in Kyiv, where her son Volodymyr lives.

        I recounted all this during my briefing at Ukraine’s Ministry of Foreign Affairs on 3 November 2008.

        President Victor Yushchenko has instituted state recognition of the Ukrainian Insurgent Army. The mass media in Russia and beyond its borders, which are manipulated by Russia’s special services, have unfolded a frantic smear campaign against the UPA, which is accused of complicity in the destruction of the Jews. On 14 October 2008, the Feast of the Protection of the Blessed Virgin Mary—the day set aside to pay homage to UPA soldiers—I gave an interview to the BBC. Here is a fragment:

        The claim that “the UPA engaged in anti-Jewish actions” is a provocation engineered by Moscow. It is a provocation. It is a lie that the UPA destroyed Jews. Tell me: how could the UPA have destroyed Jews when Jews were serving members of the UPA? I knew a Jew who served in the UPA. I also knew Dr. Abraham Shtertser, who settled in Israel after the war. There was Samuel Noiman whose [UPA] codename was Maksymovych. There was Shai Varma (codename Skrypal/Violinist). There was Roman Vynnytsky whose codename was Sam.

        There was another distinguished figure in the UPA, a woman by the name of Stella Krenzbach, who later wrote her memoirs. She was born in Bolekhiv, in the Lviv region. She was the daughter of a rabbi, she was a Zionist, and in Bolekhiv she was friends with Olia, the daughter of a [Ukrainian] Greek-Catholic priest. In 1939 Stella Krenzbach graduated from Lviv University’s Faculty of Philosophy. From 1943 she served in the UPA as a nurse and intelligence agent. In the spring of 1945 she was captured by the NKVD while meeting a courier in Rozhniativ. She was imprisoned, tortured, and sentenced to death. Later, this Jewish woman was sprung from prison by UPA soldiers. In the summer of 1945 she crossed into the Carpathian Mountains together with a group of Ukrainian insurgents, and on 1 October 1946 she reached the British Zone of Occupation in Austria. Eventually, she reached Israel. In her memoirs Stella Krenzbach writes:

        “I attribute the fact that I am alive today and devoting all the strength of my thirty-eight years to a free Israel only to God and the Ukrainian Insurgent Army. I became a member of the heroic UPA on 7 November 1943. In our group I counted twelve Jews, eight of whom were doctors.”

        I trust that the Ukrainian state will name all of these individuals. The Ukrainian state will proclaim as heroes these people who, although they were not ethnic Ukrainians, fought for Ukraine’s independence. To me personally, the UPA is sacred. In my opinion, the UPA is sacred to all individuals who, regardless of their ethnic backgrounds, have a bit of Ukraine in their souls.

        Russia’s special services are seeking to destabilize the situation in Ukraine, undermine its sovereignty and independence, create a negative image of this country, block its integration into European and Euro-Atlantic structures, and turn Ukraine into a dependent and manipulated satellite. In their special operations against Ukraine they attribute exceptional importance to the “Jewish card.”

        They want to set the Ukrainians and Jews against each other by means of the well known method of “Divide and conquer.” They will not succeed in either dividing us or ruling over us.

        Moses Fishbein is a distinguished Ukrainian poet and translator, winner of the Vasyl Stus Prize, and a member of the Ukrainian Center of the International PEN Club and the National Union of Writers of Ukraine. Academician Ivan Dziuba calls him a “Poet by the Grace of God.” He is listed in various world encyclopedias. He is the recipient of Ukraine’s Order of Prince Yaroslav Mudry, V Degree, and the Order of Holy Prince Volodymyr the Great, Equal to the Apostles, III Degree.

  4. Oh well, more Holocaust denial and glorification of Nazi collaborators and anti-Semites from this blog’s village idiot, Georg a.k.a. Yuri/Bogdan/LES/elmer etc. I guess that’s what you can expect from someone who talks to himself and who oscilates between Soviet nostalgia and neo-Nazism.

    • A. you little simplistic vampire,

      Never have I ever “Oscilated” (learn to spell you moron) between “Soviet nostalgia and neo-Nazism.”

      You advocated your “Romanian liberation” which turned out to be ethnic cleansing of Ukrainians, Jews with a few Russians thrown in.

      @A. You Write something stupid and spam! Nothing but a waste product. You should be banned, for harassment and stupidity. Nothing of value or truth in your posts. Just a fill in for Neo Bolshevik Provocations.

    • A. wrote:
      village idiot, Georg a.k.a. Yuri/Bogdan/LES/elmer

      A.k.a “voroBey”

  5. Grozny: Rebuilt, Fearful and (Almost) Forgotten by the West

    http://www.opendemocracy.net/od-russia/tanya-lokshina/grozny-rebuilt-fearful-and-almost-forgotten-by-west

    Downtown Grozny, Chechnya’s capital, is ablaze with lights and full of chic shops now. But the paralysing fear remains.

  6. Btw, thousands of Russian civilians died from hunger in Stalingrad when it was besieged by…the Soviets.

    And there were also Soviet POWs in the starving pocket, who were eating only, well, each other.

  7. In Russia, the old Evils appear in New Guises
    Your headline & article caught my eye,
    how true!

    I was amazed to read the article linked below

    Subject: North Korea and Russia – the Gulag goes on

    Very sobering
    Daniel

    http://www.forbes.com/2010/03/10/north-korea-terrorism-evil-opinions-columnists-claudia-rosett.html?boxes=opinionschannellighttop

  8. Mark, It is absolutely understandable that you love and accept the family of your wife. I do not have any qualms with that. What shocks me and, I guess others, that you go out of your way to defend the murderous regimes of the Soviet Russia and Russia of today. The only explanation I can give is that may be you are listening too much to the relatives of your wife and they are the ones who help you to form your opinions and they are the ones who support that idiot Putin. My family and I come from St.Pete’s, though we left Russia some 33 years ago and never looked back. We found freedom to be ourselves and not to be afraid. There’s never been anything remotely close to freedom in Russia and will never be as long as there are such apologists as you and your family. My mother and grandmother told me about the blockade of Leningrad. They ate glue and grass and suffered tremendously. They also told me that the warehouses full of food were destroyed by soviets because they didn’t plan ahead and didn’t care about their own people. They had to destroy the warehouses not to surrender them to germans. And by the way, the fat cats of administration lived very well during those days and were eating as if there was no hunger around them and people didn’t drop on the streets. Nothing change much in the mentality of the rossiyans. But it is their lot. It is up to them. What I can’t understand, how are you, Mark, raised and , I presume, educated in the West, support Putinism and Medvedism with their severe restrictions on freedom of speech, assembly, legal nigilism in full swing, corruption from top to bottom and MURDER-Chlebnikov, Politkovskya, Estimirova, Magnitskyi and on and on….. That’s why I think you are KGB stooge and the last straw was the fact that you blame Georgia for attacking Russia. lol. Read A. Illarionov analysis or Even very”careful” report.
    Tagliani report. I doubt you will. You might come to the conclusions that are not suitable for your “bosses”. When russians sell out their souls-you know it is from fear. But you? What a shame and disgust.

    • Where are you getting this from? This is far from the first time somebody on this blog castigates my “supporting Putinism and Medvedism”. Where??? I could care less about the Russian government and am certainly not an “apologist” for it. I just cannot reconcile how a blog which offers as its mission statement “to see Russia become a prosperous, democratic, contributing member of the world community ” is in reality nothing but non-stop carpet-bombing hatred of everything Russian. Nonsense!! Tell the truth, and change it to “promote hatred of Russia and its people in the hope of installing prominent Russian businessmen and dissidents in place of the current government”.

      I personally don’t care who runs Russia, as long as it represents the true democratic will of the Russian people and not the interests of a bunch of agitators from outside Russia. I don’t believe Nemtsov, Kodorkhovsly or Kasparov is the next great leader, because the latter has no experience and the former two are a proven failure at government and a multimillionaire who is out of touch with ordinary people’s concerns – but if that were the decision of Russians, fine. None of my business.

      No, what I object to are the blatantly racist contentions that ALL Russians are murdering bastards, uncouth savages and any number of other accusations. That’s not true. If such statements began with “some Russians” or even “most Russians”, fine. That’s your opinion, and you’re welcome to it. When it just says “Russians” or “all Russians”, it’s hate propaganda.

      There isn’t any KGB any more, so I don’t know where you’re getting that. The majority of Saakashvili’s allies agreed that Georgia launched the attack, there are any number of news sites that so report. Maybe Russia was just waiting for such a provocation, but we’ll never know now, will we?

      Show me an example of where I “go out of my way to defend the murderous regimes of the Soviet Russia and Russia of today”. Anything I cite as a fact is so indicated and supported, anything else is an opinion, and nowhere do I say, “I’m a fan of the Russian government, I think Putin and Medvedev are great leaders with the interests of the Russian people at heart”, or any such “KGB stooge” nonsense.

      • Khodorkovsky, I meant. Typo.

      • Actually Mark, if you bothered to read the IFFC report, they stated that the Georgians “over reacted” to a very long series of provocations, including the illegal arming and support of separatist forces by the Russians, multiple illegal armed attacks on Georgian civilians (of both Georgian and Ossetian ethnicity) by the separatists etc etc etc.

        Interestingly enough, the IFFC described all of the Russian actions as completely illegal, and stated specifically that the Russian actions appeared premeditated.

        Once again your ignorance is pretty astounding….

  9. I elected to throw few jabs (via facts…) into this, rather tedious and intellectually useless exercise for one humanitarian reason: to make that Andrew-dude a better husband!!!
    Here are the 2 cases that deviate you from been a rational hater:
    a)You ain’t got freaking clue about the difference between Russia and Soviet Union,
    or between Russian Empire and A Soviet Empire
    b)The World War !! was not a war of Germany against the Jews, but for the Arian race superiority…The word: “Shoah” ( “Holocaust” in English)was coined for atrocities,committed against european Jews. 59 000 000 were killed or died during that war. Soviet Union alone has lost almost 30 mln. And your silly contra-argument,emphasizing the number of Jewish victims, abuses the memory of “Shoah”. As far as reparations: you will never understand how shameful for many-many Jews (this one included!) the very idea of check-booking from unimaginable tragedy…
    Spew at me any hate you have mastered through your ever-limited capacity to make an intelligent observation,but you deserve the wife you have,for, she deserves the husband,that she has… I do have a news for you: there is no Russia,yet…there can be no Ukraine… etc…but that conversation is not for the Time of Nothingness . Be productive: do your wife…

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